#1 2022-12-08 21:34:42
I know, I know. A good article from "The Hill" with numbers that are interesting:
https://thehill.com/opinion/campaign/37 … t-weapons/
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#2 2022-12-08 22:21:01
That article just uses a lot of words to say, "acceptable risk".
Sometimes, it's not just about the numbers, it the lives. We lose less than a dozen kids a year to hot-car deaths, yet we spend money on awareness campaigns and safety features for cars to mitigate them. Crib injuries? You bet your ass there's a recall.
It is literally ONLY GUNS where people shrug and say, "Eh, what can you do?"
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#3 2022-12-09 03:49:26
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#4 2022-12-09 13:17:30
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#5 2022-12-09 18:13:43
BorderCount wrote:
That article just uses a lot of words to say, "acceptable risk".
Sometimes, it's not just about the numbers, it the lives. We lose less than a dozen kids a year to hot-car deaths, yet we spend money on awareness campaigns and safety features for cars to mitigate them. Crib injuries? You bet your ass there's a recall.
It is literally ONLY GUNS where people shrug and say, "Eh, what can you do?"
In Oregon, we had 200 or so deaths from guns last year, some 60 percent due to suicide. We had over 800 deaths from fentanyl & other opiates. What is the connecting factor to these seemingly disparate situations? Outside of the fact that the media goes apeshit over guns, but drug deaths? Nah. No big thing. Both of these are rooted in the same social dynamic that is destroying the society. The current solution is to put a band-aid on a small pox pustule. Good optics, but it will not address the actual cause of the malaise. We can pass draconian gun laws from here to eternity, to no real effect just like the draconian laws for that great success of the last 52 years, "The War on Drugs".
"It is literally ONLY GUNS where people shrug and say, "Eh, what can you do?" = It's only junkies, homeless people, mentally ill people, "Eh, what can you do?"
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#6 2022-12-09 19:27:57
Why don't we do something about both problems? By the way, we've never tried draconian gun laws, have we? Given the current state of the law as seen by the Supremes, laws can only work on the margins. Will changes such as limiting the capacity of ammunition clips, red flag laws, etc. have a big impact? No, but that does not mean they will have zero impact.
The media is hardly silent about the overdose rate, so that is kind of beside the point. It gets a lot of attention. The war on drugs is a colossal failure, as noted. What we can do is recognize that addiction is a health issue and should be met with lots of education and treatment availability. IS that likely to have a big impact? I'd like to find out.
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#7 2022-12-09 20:42:05
DmtDusty wrote:
BorderCount wrote:
That article just uses a lot of words to say, "acceptable risk".
Sometimes, it's not just about the numbers, it the lives. We lose less than a dozen kids a year to hot-car deaths, yet we spend money on awareness campaigns and safety features for cars to mitigate them. Crib injuries? You bet your ass there's a recall.
It is literally ONLY GUNS where people shrug and say, "Eh, what can you do?"In Oregon, we had 200 or so deaths from guns last year, some 60 percent due to suicide. We had over 800 deaths from fentanyl & other opiates. What is the connecting factor to these seemingly disparate situations? Outside of the fact that the media goes apeshit over guns, but drug deaths? Nah. No big thing. Both of these are rooted in the same social dynamic that is destroying the society. The current solution is to put a band-aid on a small pox pustule. Good optics, but it will not address the actual cause of the malaise. We can pass draconian gun laws from here to eternity, to no real effect just like the draconian laws for that great success of the last 52 years, "The War on Drugs".
"It is literally ONLY GUNS where people shrug and say, "Eh, what can you do?" = It's only junkies, homeless people, mentally ill people, "Eh, what can you do?"
Dude, you are SO much better than having to resort to 'whatbaoutism'.
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#8 2022-12-10 00:18:52
Border, I see it all connected to the same malaise. I have watched the country slide since Reagan on down, and witnessed people lose hope, as rents rise, both parents have to work to feed their kids, whilst both political parties place gotcha with each other endlessly. It isn't the needle/pipe, it isn't the gun. The system is rigged against the populace, forcing people to keep their heads down and plow on otherwise they can join the homeless living in tents. People don't hurt or kill each other without a reason.
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#9 2022-12-10 08:35:29
I have always agreed that are, indeed, numerous factors that result in some of these horrible tragedies and that we need to address those, as well. But we can't just do nothing to impede the ability of these depressed/deranged/whatever people to commit such atrocities.
When McVeigh blew up an FBI building, we saw tighter restrictions on who can buy how much fertilizer.
One clown tries to blow up a plane with his shoe, and now we all have to take our shoes off at the airport.
Gun violence doesn't have an either/or solution; we can address socio-economic factors AND stop making it stupid easy to acquire weapons can kill/injure hundreds of people in just a few minutes (see: Las Vegas).
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#10 2022-12-10 13:31:39
I agree pretty much on what you are saying. I think people have the right to feel safe, and that dovetails with defending themselves if necessary.
I have had a lifetime practice of Ahimsa. With that said, I have had to defend others from harm over the years (Ahimsa allows self & community defense). I didn't enjoy that, but it had to be done. With as little harm to others as possible I might add. I/we were lucky in that. Many people find themselves in the same situation, and it doesn't make the news. It is perhaps the true norm.
I think the wedge issue situations used by Politicians along with the Ghouls who run the media stories "If it bleeds it leads" are largely culpable with the current state of affairs. A sleeping populace doesn't help either.
It strikes me that if you truly want to do away with firearms, it will have to be a re-write of the Constitution. That is a huge hurdle IMO. Short of that, unless we truly address the real problems underlying the society it will be for naught.
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#11 2022-12-10 20:38:50
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#12 2022-12-10 21:20:25
DmtDusty wrote:
It strikes me that if you truly want to do away with firearms, it will have to be a re-write of the Constitution.
I have never - NEVER - actually advocated for the complete removal of all firearms. I just want more sensible controls on the types of firearms your average Joe Schmoe should be able to get his hands on. I admit it won't stop all shootings, or even all mass shootings (see the Walmart shooting the week of Thanksgiving). But if the choice is between enhancing public safety or letting those military LARPers run around unchecked, I know which one I'm going with.
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#13 2022-12-11 12:29:32
BorderCount wrote:
DmtDusty wrote:
It strikes me that if you truly want to do away with firearms, it will have to be a re-write of the Constitution.
I have never - NEVER - actually advocated for the complete removal of all firearms. I just want more sensible controls on the types of firearms your average Joe Schmoe should be able to get his hands on. I admit it won't stop all shootings, or even all mass shootings (see the Walmart shooting the week of Thanksgiving). But if the choice is between enhancing public safety or letting those military LARPers run around unchecked, I know which one I'm going with.
Yeah, that last part is what really bothers me. So that these terrified dumbshits can feel safe by walking around with rifles or pistols (for all the honest world to feel, I suppose) you never know if the person who just came into the restaurant, etc. openly wearing a weapon is just another cosplayer, or actually intends on shooting up the place.
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#14 2022-12-11 16:34:54
I don't mind people having any gun. I just don't want to see it in public unless you are hunting, or at the range. 99.999% of gun owners are not those people.
As far as semi auto rifles with detachable magazines, black or wood, they go back to 1907
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Winchester_Model_1907 
Pistols are far more the problem, but they will never be thrown under the bus.
I want people to be safe, and if need be, to be able to defend themselves. It isn't like history has stated from the paleolithic forward that we as a species is exactly peace loving as a whole.
https://www.dailykos.com/stories/2019/9 … ey-are-now
There is certainly plenty to dislike about one of the recent iterations of gun/tacticool "culture". WTF is that anyway?
Last edited by DmtDusty (2022-12-11 16:39:11)
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#15 2022-12-11 21:48:47
Hand guns (pistols and the like) are only really useful and used for shooting yourself or someone you love.
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